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Post by Droog on Jul 15, 2019 23:05:52 GMT
I had to get a relay for the aprilia. It was loads of money for the original part. Even a pattern part was not cheap. I just copied the details off the side of the relay and did a search. Got one via China on eBay for about £3. Works fine.
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 16, 2019 6:53:28 GMT
I had to get a relay for the aprilia. It was loads of money for the original part. Even a pattern part was not cheap. I just copied the details off the side of the relay and did a search. Got one via China on eBay for about £3. Works fine. But how long did it take to arrive? I can't be doing with 15 days delivery time. Yesterday I found a guy breaking a bike like mine less than 3km from my house. I didn't want a used part, but if he has one and it's cheap I think I'll take a punt. EDIT: Just found one on AliExpress for 3.50€ plus 2€ postage... estimated delivery.... 1st September!!  |
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Post by Droog on Jul 16, 2019 17:00:05 GMT
I just checked my ebay. I ordered it on the 28th March and it advised over a month for delivery. I'm sure it came within 10 days though? Maybe less. It actually cost me £4.19
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 16, 2019 18:07:20 GMT
OK, just took the relay out of the bike into the house and rigged up a 12v supply to energise the coil.
Relay cold: Steady continuity (actually a resistance of around 80 ohms on the meter) between the pins connecting the two orange ignition circuit wires when 12v applied to the coil.
But, after putting the relay in an empty covered glass sat in boiling water for 10 minutes (relay pretty hot to the touch), the continuity fluctuated quite a lot. During the time I was holding the probes on the pins, there were moments of over 1 second of no continuity showing on the meter, although the meter never actually settled down to give a constant reading. The lowest resistance I could see in the fluctuating numbers was around 250 ohms.
I would say that it is going to be worth investing in another relay.
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 18, 2019 7:38:05 GMT
Plan for today:
My new relay should arrive. But instead of putting it straight in the bike, I am going to do one last test:
I have taken the base plate off my original relay, exposing the prongs of the pins up to where they connect to the PCB. I have soldered a wire onto the pin which feeds power to the ignition circuit (the 12v out when the coil is energised). I have soldered this on close to the PCB so that the relay can still be properly connected to the base, and drilled a hole in the relay casing to pass the wire through. I will connect this to my voltmeter and go out for a ride with the new relay in my pocket.
Hopefully, if all goes to plan, I will see voltage fluctuations on the voltmeter when the relay gets hot and the bike will cut out. I will remove the old relay, put in the new one and all will be OK!!
That's the theory anyway....
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Post by neilf on Jul 18, 2019 8:02:06 GMT
Dumb question Clipper, and I'm sure that you've already considered this, but is the relay sitting next to something else that could be over heating? From what i can remember after trying to diagnose my K5's issue at the roadside last year, there shouldn't be anything in the immediate vicinity, but my memory is sketchy at best!
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 18, 2019 8:15:23 GMT
Dumb question Clipper, and I'm sure that you've already considered this, but is the relay sitting next to something else that could be over heating? From what i can remember after trying to diagnose my K5's issue at the roadside last year, there shouldn't be anything in the immediate vicinity, but my memory is sketchy at best! Good question Neil, but no, the relay sits on its own next to the fusebox, just behind the ECU. All the components under the seat are getting warm uniformly, I mean that there isn't any particular worrying hot spot or source of heat. And the relay itself is not getting hotter than any other component as you might expect from a short circuit. I think that the contacts on the relay are just getting worn, which is compounded by heat (normal heat from operation in hot weather). |
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 22, 2019 8:07:53 GMT
So, it isn't the relay causing the problem.
This weekend the bike died again (with the old relay in it) but the voltage on the output of the relay remained at over 12V.
I put the new relay in anyway, but it died again a few minutes later.
The wire from the relay goes straight to the kill switch, so I've now soldered a wire into the kill switch on the wire coming from the relay. I can use this wire connected to my voltmeter to see if power is being lost between the relay and the kill switch..
This is getting quite tiresome...
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Post by Droog on Jul 22, 2019 16:45:15 GMT
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Post by armstrongracer on Jul 23, 2019 0:06:30 GMT
Normal mode for regulator/rectifier failure is either to fry the battery or for the battery to go flat overnight because the diode fails & let's the battery discharge to earth.
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Post by armstrongracer on Jul 23, 2019 0:16:56 GMT
Wonder if it's the ecu going on the frit. Chips can go awol if they go over temperature. Maybe some heat reflecting pads to reflect heat away from electronics may help.
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 23, 2019 7:08:49 GMT
I tested the charging system / battery and all is fine, so I doubt it's reg/rec related, but I've been wrong before...
I'm also beginning to think ECU, but that's an expensive part to change "on the off chance".
After wiring in my sensor wire to the kill switch on Sunday, I realised however that I have potentially been wasting my time and looking in the wrong place all this time.
Because the dash display shows "CHEC" when the bike dies, I had assumed that the interlock circuit was de-energising, i.e. the bike was thinking that either the side stand was down (when in gear), or the kill switch was off. These are the two conditions when you can normally see "CHEC" displayed.
But, I suddenly realised that if this was happening, the starter motor wouldn't spin (the whole purpose of that circuit being to stop the rider from starting the bike). But when mine dies the ignition coils all die, and the fuel pump relay de-energises, but the starter motor is still working. I can spin the motor over on the button even when the fault is still present. So it cannot be a totally dead interlock circuit.
If this theory is correct, the next time I ride it and it dies, I should still be seeing 12v at the kill switch (at the moment I have the sensor wire on the input side of the switch, but it should also be live on the output side).
If this is what happens I will have to find the wiring which energises the ignition coils and the fuel pump relay but after it splits from the interlock circuit. I have it located on the schematic, but not physically on the bike yet.
It is my new hope!
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Post by neilf on Jul 23, 2019 10:42:46 GMT
Have you looked at the tilt switch?
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Post by Droog on Jul 24, 2019 6:01:52 GMT
Is there a side stand switch present?
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Post by Diego the toe clipper on Jul 24, 2019 6:37:41 GMT
Have you looked at the tilt switch? Yes, although I only tested it to make sure that it "failed" as it should, and that gave an error code, which I am not getting when the bike cuts out. The tilt switch, even if it fails (thinking that the bike has fallen over) would not give the same symptoms as the fault. |
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